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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 4:41 am 
change log:

Trackerless support
Internationalization, a few translations are on their way
Integrate torrent creation into the UI
Fix for corrupted config files
Fix (hopefully) for TCP stack flaking out problem
Fix for seeding a torrent you created when there are other torrents in the queue
Fix error display for btdownloadheadless.py when there are lots of errors


BitTorrent Goes Trackerless: Publishing with BitTorrent gets easier!

As part of our ongoing efforts to make publishing files on the Web painless and disruptively cheap, BitTorrent has released a 'trackerless' version of BitTorrent in a new release.

Suppose you bought a television station, you could broadcast your progamming to everyone in a 50 mile radius. Now suppose the population of your town tripled. How much more does it cost you to broadcast to 3 times as many people? Nothing. The same is not true of the Web. If you own a website and you publish your latest video on it, as popularity increases, so does your bandwidth bill! Sometimes by a lot! However, thanks to BitTorrent the website owner gets almost near-broadcast economics on the web by harnessing the unused upstream bandwidth of his/her users.

In prior versions of BitTorrent, publishing was a 3 step process. You would:

1. Create a ".torrent" file -- a summary of your file which you can put on your blog or website
2. Create a "tracker" for that file on your webserver so that your downloaders can find each other
3. Create a "seed" copy of your download so that your first downloader has a place to download from

Many of you have blogs and websites, but dont have the resources to set up a tracker. In the new version, we've created an optional 'trackerless' method of publication. Anyone with a website and an Internet connection can host a BitTorrent download!

While it is called trackerless, in practice it makes every client a lightweight tracker. A clever protocol, based on a Kademlia distributed hash table or "DHT", allows clients to efficiently store and retrieve contact information for peers in a torrent.

When generating a torrent, you can choose to utilize the trackerless system or a traditional dedicated tracker. A dedicated tracker allows you to collect statistics about downloads and gives you a measure of control over the reliability of downloads. The trackerless system makes no guarantees to reliability but requires no resources of the publisher. The trackerless system is not consulted when downloading a traditionally tracked torrent.


http://www.bittorrent.com/


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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 12:44 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2005 4:38 pm
Posts: 6
I'm interested in seeing how this pans out. Trackerless support is a step in the right direction for a great deal of 'communities' where people don't want web pages with lists and a great deal of other things, but the question I really want to ask is for THESHADOW, I recall you saying you will not implement any of the new BT stuff because of Bram's change in License, this includes trackerless support? Perhaps you mean to implement it your own way.. this could cost alot of development time, why not go with the new license and use his code?

Just a thought


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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 3:23 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2004 10:05 am
Posts: 1212
I can implement it, but I can't COPY it. And there's been no spec published.


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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 4:40 pm 
I'm more interested in the Azureus kademila trackerless torrent method, that's GPL and should be documented, though difficult to reimplement in python I'm sure. That, and BitTorrent now has seeding options, like "stop when xx ratio has been reached", currently I throttle it to 1kbps upload overnight so I don't wake up with 50gb transferred. Otherwise, BTornado is the best client. The next GUI should be interesting.


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PostPosted: Thu May 19, 2005 11:08 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2004 10:05 am
Posts: 1212
My license is less restrictive than GPL and I do not wish to GPLize BitTornado.


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PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 4:44 am 
Quote:
I can implement it, but I can't COPY it. And there's been no spec published.

You can, but would you?


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PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 5:27 am 
TheSHAD0W-
BitTorrent 4.1.0 beta uses khashmir for DHT
http://khashmir.sourceforge.net/


khashmir is under the MIT license:

Quote:
Unless otherwise noted, all files are released under the MIT
license, exceptions contain licensing information in them.

Copyright (C) 2002-2003 Andrew Loewenstern

Permission is hereby granted, free of charge, to any person
obtaining a copy of this software and associated documentation files
(the "Software"), to deal in the Software without restriction,
including without limitation the rights to use, copy, modify, merge,
publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell copies of the Software,
and to permit persons to whom the Software is furnished to do so,
subject to the following conditions:

The above copyright notice and this permission notice shall be
included in all copies or substantial portions of the Software.

The Software is provided "AS IS", without warranty of any kind,
express or implied, including but not limited to the warranties of
merchantability, fitness for a particular purpose and
noninfringement. In no event shall the authors or copyright holders
be liable for any claim, damages or other liability, whether in an
action of contract, tort or otherwise, arising from, out of or in
connection with the Software or the use or other dealings in the
Software.


Can you use it for bittornado?


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PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 10:20 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2004 10:05 am
Posts: 1212
Sure, but I still need a spec to work off of. I *could* look at official's code and then re-implement it, but it'd mean a potential poisoning of my code with official's license. (Actually, it'd be easier to do with Azureus, since there's no way it'd be a copy, it'd have to be a translation -- except I don't know Java.)


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PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 8:30 pm 
You could maybe split BTornado into two "threads", a GPLed version that contains all features off the official release.. And a MIT licence continuing to be free but less feature rich.

I am a big fan of the MIT licence but fear that I might be forced to switch to one more closely linked to the official release as BTornado becomes less and less "standard".

I appreciate that there are no standards published that thus you either have to reverse engineer (with risks of poisoning) or guess your way though but I am just telling you my realities. :)


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PostPosted: Fri May 20, 2005 10:46 pm 
TheSHAD0W I think you should just focus on the features you have planned and not worry about bittorrent.


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PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 10:02 am 
The trackerless protocol is certainly useful for classic P2P transfers, but for legitimate & legal downloads there is less of a need for it. Bittorrent trackers are becoming increasingly robust and sites that wish to distribute their own content over bittorrent are now finding very few problems setting it up (eg BNBT will work on any PHP & MySQL enabled server, while there are several C++ trackers around now that will happily sit on a fairly low spec PC).

Just out of interest: has anybody worked out how much bandwidth an average client uses maintaining trackerless information across the swarm?

Sidenote: I personally find that I use BitTornado more as a seeder than a download client these days and haven't found any client that seeds as efficiently. The main thing I've been waiting for is multi-torrent interface (not only easier to manage GUI but also port-sharing for all torrents).


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PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 11:54 am 
Anonymous wrote:
The trackerless protocol is certainly useful for classic P2P transfers, but for legitimate & legal downloads there is less of a need for it.


I disagree. For example if I just want to share a video I have made on a forum, instead of finding a tracker, then linking to the *.torrent and hoping the tracker doesn't die I can just hit a button and use this PC (or any server) as a tracker without having to worry about setting one up myself...

Trackerless torrents are the same thing as a home web-server, and nobody is going to claim that all they are used for is illegal content now are they? :roll:


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PostPosted: Sat May 21, 2005 6:40 pm 
Has anyone actually gotten it to work? using their beta release?

Been hammering away at this with a group of friends for 4 hours now, trying everything. no dice :(

Ideas?


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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 5:40 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 12:15 am
Posts: 534
Manip wrote:
Anonymous wrote:
The trackerless protocol is certainly useful for classic P2P transfers, but for legitimate & legal downloads there is less of a need for it.


I disagree. For example if I just want to share a video I have made on a forum, instead of finding a tracker, then linking to the *.torrent and hoping the tracker doesn't die I can just hit a button and use this PC (or any server) as a tracker without having to worry about setting one up myself...

If you're releasing enough legit content to need a torrent, you have the resources and time for a tracker.

Manip wrote:
Trackerless torrents are the same thing as a home web-server, and nobody is going to claim that all they are used for is illegal content now are they? :roll:

*cough*MPAA*cough*


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PostPosted: Sun May 22, 2005 4:33 pm 
Anonymous wrote:
Has anyone actually gotten it to work? using their beta release?

Been hammering away at this with a group of friends for 4 hours now, trying everything. no dice :(

Ideas?


It doesn't work for me either :(


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